Conquering Overwhelm with Mindful Miri

Conquering Overwhelm with Mindful Miri

In this episode, the hosts, Cheryl and Colleen, have a heart-to-heart chat with Miriam Burlakovsky, creator of Mindful Miri..

We discuss our personal parenting experiences, handling anxiety, cultivating mindfulness, and much more. Miriam shares about self-love, body acceptance and her own application which is a part of her “BFF”, Body Freedom Formula.

To find more information on Miriam’s systems for successfully overcoming overwhelm and using her BFF system for weight release and body acceptance visit her website www.mindfulmiri.com. Follow along on instagram @mindful_miri. And download her app “Mindful Miri” on Google or Apple. And be sure to listen to her podcast!

Transcript

Cheryl: 0:00

Mommy's actually bigger than daddy. I don't know if you noticed, daddy, get on my back. I'm gonna squat you for the girls He doesn't like that, but he'll participate. Good day listeners. are back and Colleen is here. And today we have Miriam Burlakovsky, which her last name is so special that she has a visual representation that she shares with you when you ask how to say it. and I'll have to put it in the show notes or somehow put it on our Instagram because I laughed real hard. Miriam is a trained, school psychologist. She's a behavior analyst, yoga, meditation, mindfulness based stress reduction, trauma and resilience informed practicer. She's also the host of Mindful Miri podcasts. Miriam is on a mission to empower 1 million women to feel amazing in their bodies without dieting or deprivation. She's a highly rated speaker and coach with over 25 years of public speaking experience, and she is like a bright light. So Miriam, welcome and thank you for joining us.

Miriam Burlakovsky: 1:39

Thank you. Thank you so much for having me. I'm thrilled to be here.

Colleen: 1:42

Oh, Oh, we're so excited.

Cheryl: 1:44

Miriam is a wealth of topics that we could speak about. asked her to talk to us about being an overwhelmed mom and, Weight loss, reducing weight when, we are overwhelmed and super busy and crazy. we've talked about this before. Colleen and I are more to love. We're we're real soft hugs and, you know. I'm fine with that, except it's, it is getting a little uncomfortable to move around the world occasionally. So that's really more my focus and health. But, I want to remind everybody that's listening right now, the way you look is the least interesting thing about you, and you're incredible just the way you are. But if you find yourself in a body that is uncomfortable to carry, Some of this conversation will be for you. If you're a parent and you lose your shit more than you'd like. This conversation's gonna be for you. So Miriam, please help.

Collen: 2:36

Miriam, fix us.

Miriam Burlavosky: 2:37

Gosh. Okay. Magic wand coming out. you're fixed. Kazaaam!.

Cheryl: 2:42

Thank you. Great. So that's a wrap. We'll see you guys

Miriam Burlavosky: 2:48

So, yeah, let's, let's stop overeating and under exercising and yelling at our children. So there you go. You're fixed, you're

Collen: 2:58

Yeah.

Cheryl: 2:59

Just got so much better.

Miriam Burlavosky: 3:01

right there is this, this SNL skit with um. I'm gonna date myself, but like, uh, Bob Newhart that, like, he, he's playing a psychiatrist and people keep coming into him and, and they're like, well, um, I really need help. I keep perseverating all these thoughts. And, and he's like, okay, stop it. And it's like, And they're like, well. He's like, you're not cured yet. It's a dollar a minute, like Are you done yet? My name is Miriam. I wear a lot of hats. Um, one of them. Is mom and stepmom. I have four, sometimes five beautiful children, and I'm a school psychologist, educational, licensed, educational psychologist, behavior analyst. Like, so I basically what that all of that means is I teach yoga. I, I am an expert at behavior change in others, especially those with autism, but also fitness wise and you know, I have expertise in, in learning disabilities in, school systems, in a lot of those arenas. But let's tackle overwhelmed moms today or not tackle them. Let's embrace them and,

Cheryl: 4:22

I need to be tackled

Miriam Burlavosky: 4:23

and give them a nice hug and, and practice self-compassion. A couple years ago I was, well, I, so let me, let me tell you a little bit about my weight loss story, or my weight, uh, what should I call it?

Cheryl: 4:40

In hypnotherapy, they call it weight release.

Miriam Burlavosky: 4:42

Yes. Weight

Collen: 4:43

No. Okay.

Miriam Burlavosky: 4:44

you don't wanna lose anything, right? We don't, we don't like losing things.

Cheryl: 4:48

Mm-Hmm.

Miriam Burlavosky: 4:48

Um,

Cheryl: 4:49

We wanna release

Miriam Burlavosky: 4:51

Release it. So I started my, I went on my very first diet when I was eight years old. And, came from a, you know, somewhat tumultuous home environment. I have four or five adverse childhood experiences called ACEs. that is what we call trauma, and I believe that those are closely linked to my weight struggle. and I just wanted to be loved and accepted and to please everyone, right? I saw SlimFast commercial and I thought, oh, I, you know, these ladies look great and I need to look great so that people praise me. And so I started on that journey, at eight years old And

Collen: 5:45

Two shakes a day, and a meal. It's so easy, right?

Miriam Burlavosky: 5:48

I mean it's right. then, I went through, I've, I've done a lot of different diets. I was an athlete, I was a gymnast, so that's a lot of being a, you know, the tallest, heaviest gymnast in the, in the group is, is a difficult Yeah, you too

Collen: 6:09

Yeah.

Miriam Burlavosky: 6:10

a difficult thing to do when I'm, I'm the only one who can't do a pull up, right?'cause I'm, I weigh 30 pounds more than every other kid. So I have been on a, on a journey trying to love my body and trying to make peace with myself and my, and food, um, and healing my adverse childhood experiences, through all kinds of different therapies. I decided to create a program for myself. To take all of the research. I just was on a hunt. I'm, I'm a seeker, so I was on a hunt for all this information. I used my psych background, I used my behavior change expertise and put it all together, and I created a program that I started. So I recorded my own voice and started listening to it myself,

Collen: 7:04

Mm. Okay.

Miriam Burlavosky: 7:05

and it brought me such comfort that I started coaching other people. On this same methodology, and my whole premise is that I believe that trauma causes disconnection from your body, and the research supports that. And so instead of always treating the symptoms, which are Overeating or, or, the, you know, obesity epidemic that's happening, I wanted to really treat the root of the problem, which is body disconnection. I needed to really be in my body and that's how I got into yoga and mindfulness and, healing that connection has really helped me. Understand why I'm eating, why I am maybe skipping a workout here or there, or why I'm overdoing it. And also it has led to a lot of eyeopening experiences in terms of why I am people pleasing, why I'm creating myself as a martyr, as a mom martyr, as a professional martyr. And, all of these things are related., I'm working on a book for the methodology, but I do have an app and, I listen to it myself every day. It's like I created my own cure and I'm just like curing myself over and over.

Collen: 8:44

talk to us a little bit about that. I mean, it sounds magical, but like it's, you're, we're obviously not waving The app in front of our faces and all of our body fat is disappearing. So like, talk to us a little bit about what, what, what, yeah, that'd be amazing. Like, but what does that, like, if we're to download your app, which we would love for people to do, like what, what are we gonna see? What are we gonna be doing?

Miriam Burlavosky: 9:10

I call it the Body Freedom Formula, BFF. And,

Collen: 9:15

Love

Miriam Burlavosky: 9:16

what you're, what we're hoping to do is create be your own BFF for your body. I have several different modules, I have what's called, I call it like the six weeks to sexy. And it's just, it sounds nice or whatever, you know, but it's, uh, it's, catchy. I love alliteration. So that's, that's mostly me. I start out with, you know, how we got here and just. one of my lessons, is pretty, is not your purpose. Like you are not here put on this planet to be pretty for others. Like attractiveness is not your main asset. That's the least. I think you said that earlier, Colleen, is that's the least important thing about your, or interesting thing about you

Collen: 10:03

Yeah, that's Cheryl's slogan. But isn't it interesting that that's the thing that we're taught so early on society and like a patriarchal society, if you will, is like, well, you better be pretty and if you're pretty, if you're not pretty, you're bad. Like that's what we're told very early on.

Miriam Burlavosky: 10:23

Yes. And like, nobody's gonna wanna be your friend. You're not gonna be loved. I start with Compassion. That's our main thing is if we don't have compassion for ourselves, there's no way that we are gonna grow. I see it in my students. If, if they are not feeling good about themselves, if their teacher does not believe in them, they are not learning. we are not growing as humans unless we are being positive about ourselves and we believe in ourselves. No matter how much you wanna white knuckle it, we are not gonna get anywhere. I. if we, if we're not, you know, loving ourselves.

Cheryl: 11:05

when I was young, I was told constantly how beautiful I was and to the point where like, it's lo it lost all its value, you know? I was like, this is just what people say to everybody. And sometimes I wonder if I've gone to where I have with my weight, like I certainly have some ACEs of my own, but I sometimes wonder if I've gotten to here with my weight because I was just like, I disconnected from beauty in some way. Like I don't like it's not important and it was all people saw.

Miriam Burlavosky: 11:32

Mm-Hmm.

Collen: 11:33

Yeah.

Cheryl: 11:33

So sometimes I wonder if that is where I got to where I am now.

Collen: 11:38

And it's so interesting, Miriam, you're talking about like the gymnastics thing resonates with me. I. So vividly, I don't know what the word is, but so strongly, uh, especially, I don't know, I mean like growing up in the 80, I am 41 now. Um, but like growing up in the eighties and nineties, gymnastics was like a really popular thing and there were a lot of really popular gymnasts and I mean, I was. You know, like I'm five six now, right? And so I was like, just like you said, like taller than most of the girls and bigger than most of the girls.

Miriam Burlavosky: 12:19

yes.

Collen: 12:19

that culture was so awful. I'll just say it was so awful. Like when they, my coach told me when I was six, you know, you said you were started on a diet when you were eight. I started when I was six. Like I was told next time you want to eat something, just eat half of it. because you're eating too much, and it's like to tell that to a child, like now that I have children, I'm like to tell that to a child. Is so intense and so fucked up by, you know, like, but those are the things that we, that, you know, become. So Im impinge you as a person so early on in your life that then, yeah, like your value, your worth, your confidence becomes about your body. And, and I think we've talked about this before, like. Trying to not have, like, my goal for me, and now I have a daughter, is like to not just not have attention on my body, right? Like I am, I'm in my body, I'm here, you know, I like to look beautiful. I like to, to do these things, but it's, it's not the most important thing. That we're working on. And I don't wanna be constantly like moving my shirt and stuffing my, pulling up my pants and like making sure I'm sitting so that my gut's not showing. Like those are the things that I would like to not be doing, and those are the things I want my daughter to never have to feel like she has to do. So I. So how do, how are we, like, how are we doing that Like how are, how are we doing that through, you know, your teachings or your practice or your app? Like is it all mental or is there physical aspects to those things?

Miriam Burlavosky: 14:05

The inner work is the most important. I think reconnecting your body and mind are, and soul spirit, um, if you wanna go there, I, I do, but, um, not everybody, it's not palatable for everybody, but I really think that, that, you know, we are, we are, um, Non-physical beings inhabiting a physical body right now and, in this body, I mean, this is, I think Glennon Doyle says, your body is not your masterpiece. It's a paintbrush. So this is our tool, our tool, our vehicle to get through life and. We're gonna take care of it. and if you don't take care of it, then it's not gonna serve you well. Now many of us have been trying to take care of it, um, by, by, you know, undereating or over exercising or, um. You know, later binging on sugar or something like that. But basically our, our bodies are keeping us safe. That is our number one job, is our body wants to keep us safe. So if it feels that. a calorie deficit. It is gonna go into overdrive and say, oh my gosh, there's a famine. Hey, there's a famine. Hunger. Hunger, hunger, hormones. Right? And then not only are you going to regain whatever you lost, but you're gonna get more. I mean, we, we, we lose muscle in that process of losing, of releasing weight. And then we also regain more than we. Lost typically because your body thinks that there's gonna be another famine and wants to prepare for it. So really getting to the source of, of mindset and feeling safe and really reconnecting with that body, making, just swapping cho some choices, slow swapping and building muscle. I am not a fan of calorie restriction at all. I'm actually, I had a, a blood test done where, I was doing like the, the keto diet, right? Like all these keto paleo, and it was like you actually metabolize fat slower than the rest of the population. So I'm actually better at metabolizing carbs. Number one, so is the wrong diet for me, right? Which is, that means I'm not the only, I'm not the only one That's like a lot of the population is probably gonna be more carb friendly than fat friendly. And number two, I did a blood test where, it was saying that actually calorie restriction does not work for me.

Collen: 16:58

I need that

Miriam Burlavosky: 16:59

okay, so now what?

Collen: 17:02

Yeah.

Miriam Burlavosky: 17:03

So what do I do? but I'm happy and I'm at peace. I'm about like, I, I, I mean, I'm five nine. I'll be just like fully transparent. I feel like vulnerability is strength, so I'm just gonna go out there and do it. I'm about 195 pounds right now. I'm five nine. 160 is like, I'm skinny, I'm never gonna be that girl who's like 1 15, 1 20. that's just not

Cheryl: 17:28

But also such a small amount of the population is one 20, like forever on my driver's license, I had 1 25 as if that was the weight that I was supposed to be, and I'm like, I haven't seen 1 25 since junior high.

Collen: 17:45

yeah.

Cheryl: 17:46

My body type

Collen: 17:47

I.

Cheryl: 17:48

I was banging at 17, but I was over 150 pounds already.

Miriam Burlavosky: 17:52

Yep.

Cheryl: 17:53

But

Collen: 17:53

I dunno who decided that one 15 to 1 25 was the ideal weight for women. But that is a number that is so prevalent. Like you see it everywhere, like not see it everywhere, but that's like the goal for everybody where you know, you're like, okay, but also are you five feet? You know, like, how tall are you? How, what's your muscle component? Like structure. it's so crazy.

Cheryl: 18:21

I'd love to see 180 and you'd all be like, wow, she's thin. She looks really strong at that weight. But that number is big compared to what people think that a woman should weigh. I mean, my husband is 150 pounds soaking wet.

Collen: 18:37

Yeah.

Cheryl: 18:38

our bodies are just different. The other day I was looking at new clothes in June, my baby, I. I mean, the pants are big. I'm in a big body, and she's like, those are daddies. But I also think how funny it is in their minds that they, I'm bigger than daddy. He's only an inch taller than me, and I weigh significantly more than him. They still, they see daddy as bigger because he is the man, and I'm the one which is, and they've all done it at different stages in their life where they've been like, well dad, those are big. So those are daddies. And I'm like, actually. Mommy's actually bigger than daddy. I don't know if you noticed, daddy, get on my back. I'm gonna squat you for the girls He doesn't like that, but he'll participate. Now. I've broken him

Miriam Burlavosky: 19:19

Oh, that's hilarious. Yeah. When did we, I mean, we, we do have these implicit Um, an implicit bias against, you know, certain body types, certain weight numbers, and why. When did that get programmed in?

Cheryl: 19:40

I don't know.

Collen: 19:40

I, I don't

Cheryl: 19:41

I mean, I remember it. It was on my mom's driver's license too,

Collen: 19:46

Yeah, 1 35 was

Cheryl: 19:47

but I know for a fact she wasn't, you know.

Collen: 19:51

Yeah. My mom was always 1 35 and I was always 1 35 because also, uh, just FYI, Cheryl, you do not have your weight on every driver's license in every state. California is rude and they put your weight on there. Not every state does that.

Cheryl: 20:08

California would, we're vain, California.

Collen: 20:13

I don't think my weight is on my Indiana driver's license. I don't think it's on there.

Miriam Burlavosky: 20:18

Wow.

Collen: 20:18

that crazy?

Cheryl: 20:19

That's.

Collen: 20:20

But that is such a thing. Yeah. Growing up, like you're like, what weight am I as a woman? It was always, what weight am I gonna put on my driver's license? What should I put? Like what seems realistic? But obviously I'm not putting my real weight like no one's doing that. So

Miriam Burlavosky: 20:35

Like in the off chance,

Cheryl: 20:37

Yeah. What's the officer

Miriam Burlavosky: 20:39

I'm a criminal.

Cheryl: 20:40

lying.

Miriam Burlavosky: 20:40

Right? And they put it on the tv like, what weight do I want on there?

Collen: 20:44

Or you go missing, right? Like, listen, if somebody tries to find me based on what my California driver's license said, like good luck.

Cheryl: 20:55

Yeah, they're not gonna find me. okay, so it sounds like your method for finding the weight you want is one, becoming at peace with your insides and like maybe kind of letting go of the weight that you want and just like making healthy switches.

Miriam Burlavosky: 21:14

It's really about reconnecting to the body, healing your trauma. and. Increasing the likelihood that you're going to practice the habits that you wanna practice. That's really what it comes down to, is how, how are you setting yourself up for success to do all the things that you wanna do? You know, women come to me and they're like, well, I wanna be on time for things. That's a major stressor. That has nothing to do with weight, but that is, that's a stressor that they're eating around. Right. And okay, so. What kind of environmental factors are keeping you from being on time for things, because that's a major stressor that is easily remedied. we could just, if you get there five minutes late all the time, then we'll just set your clock back 15 minutes, you know, Um, there, there just tangible actions that we can take to, to reduce that stress. So we are working with stress, we're also feeling our feelings, and that's a big one. So.

Cheryl: 22:19

hate feeling my feelings. It's

Miriam Burlavosky: 22:20

Oh, don't we all.

Cheryl: 22:22

It's.

Collen: 22:24

I want you to talk a little bit more about this time.'cause this, when you said that like my brain was like binging, my brain exploded, whatever. When you talk about like. I feel like I'm always rushing and I'm always trying to hurry and don't wanna be late. And a lot of that is like, especially as a, a mom, and I have three kids, like Cheryl does. You know, like today we were 10 minutes late to a haircut because my son didn't like the shoes he was wearing or the socks that he was wearing. So it's other people. But then what's the cycle of that? Like what's the The spiral of that is, well, now we're gonna have to eat something quick, or now we're gonna have to go and get something quick through a drive-through, or now we're late so I can't make a full meal. And that is such a really intense spiral. And maybe you can talk about this as well when we're talking about overwhelm moms, like

Miriam Burlavosky: 23:19

mm-Hmm.

Collen: 23:20

part. To be able to do all the things, do'em on time, feed everybody, and like figure out all of that stuff is such an interrelated thing that I didn't even really kind of think about until you said that. Right? It's like, what the hell man? Like that's so challenging.

Miriam Burlavosky: 23:40

It's all related. Yes. so I'm deliberately slowing my voice down.

Collen: 23:50

You don't need to. I talk really fast. I'm Greek and Italian. We just do it.

Miriam Burlavosky: 23:56

it's really about slowing down and if. If you're able,

Collen: 24:02

I don't like that answer.

Miriam Burlavosky: 24:04

I know, right? I am very much a go, go go naturally kind of person. and I, and I overwork, I overdo things. I overthink. I think that a lot of women, I. are overwhelmed because of those reasons, just overdoing, overwhelm, uh, overthinking over, analyzing, re re, um, rethinking perseverating on things that you've already done. and then things start to become your identity. And it's, it's difficult, not impossible to change that. we have to, well, when I think about. Habits. And I do think that rushing is a habit. when we think about habits, you are, you can think about it as like your brain is a mountain and you are blazing a trail, right? So you are blazing the go, go, go trail over and over and over. And the more you tread that trail, the clearer it gets, right. You're stomping down weeds and whatever foliage is growing and you're making it more and more accessible. Now, any new habit, and this goes for every habit, you're gonna have to blaze a new trail. And it may, it may be longer. A longer route to the same place, but it may be more scenic, but you still have to tread it. And the first time you tread it, you may be like all motivated, right? And you start cutting down some of that foliage and you blaze a trail. And then. You come back the next day, you're like, Ugh, that looks really weedy again. I might just go this way. That's already like really clear, but you have to keep clearing that path over and over and over. it's not an overnight kind of thing, but slowly, incrementally you can Lead by example for your whole family. And what I've started to do is, incorporate a mindfulness practice and a gratitude practice in the mornings. And that sounds like a big deal, but it literally takes me 10 minutes. and so I get up 10 minutes earlier, I have a gratitude journal on my nightstand. And so I can't forget it. It's like a cue. That's my environmental cue for that. And I sit down and I try to feel my feelings of gratitude. And even if I don't feel them, I write them down. And I do like a, I do at least 60 seconds of stillness. And that sounds like, oh, well I can't. I can't meditate for an hour, so I might as well not do it right. Like we end up with that all or nothing kind of thinking, but really, like I can do, I can do anything for 60 seconds. I can find 60 seconds in my day. I will sit there for 60 seconds. I'll set a timer. Um, there's a great app called Insight Timer that is free. There's Calm, the Calm app. I have, I incorporate 60 seconds of stillness in my In the app, uh, during every single lesson. So it's embedded in there. But really having those two things, just a, a little bit of stillness, a little bit of gratitude slows you down. You just slow your role and that, I mean, it's remarkable to see how that influences the rest of your family.

Collen: 27:44

Mm-Hmm.

Miriam Burlavosky: 27:45

so, and also. It mediates your reactions too. If you're having really big responses to small problems, like for example, if my kid was losing their, am I allowed to cuss

Collen: 27:59

Yeah, that's all the words.

Miriam Burlavosky: 28:01

if my, if my kid was losing his shit about I don't wanna wear this, these shoes or whatever, I would wanna lose my.

Collen: 28:11

Yeah. Yeah.

Miriam Burlavosky: 28:14

adding that practice in the morning has just given me an extra second between the trigger and my response. And that extra second helps me be a more chill mom and not all the time. I am by no means perfect.

Collen: 28:36

I like to call that, like being the emotional leader. That's something that I talk a lot about, like being the emotional leader in your family and in business like as realtors. That's something that Cheryl and I have to do quite a bit with our clients and everybody else is like being that emotional leader for your kids, for your family. It's really hard and I think sometimes I'm better at it. In work than I am at home. Right.

Cheryl: 29:04

I am always better at it at work than I am at home. Always better at work. I throw three-year-old temper tantrums at home. I kind of can't believe my behavior sometimes, and then I'm like, oh, and I'm the one teaching these people like I. Of course they're throwing a fit. Like occasionally I'll, I'll hear me coming outta one of their mouths and it's not attractive. And I'm like, gosh, damn it like I need, and I'm, I mean, I'm in therapy for this. This is something I'm actively working on. have a few like lines that I can say to myself, I used it this morning. Like this is not an emergency. The kids aren't doing what I want them to do. This is not an emergency. And then also like saying out loud, I'm really frustrated. What's the worst thing that's gonna come outta this? Not really to be talking to my kids, like I'm really talking to myself, but I'm also trying to model how they could respond when they're in a difficult moment. And then also having a plan for the moments that get out of control. Three so close in age one gets dysregulated and it's just like a snowball effect. And then before I know it, all four of us are dysregulated. If daddy's home five, you know, so then having a plan for what to do when those moments start to get out of, out of my control and like, and what I've seen that do, like we move, we change environment, we go to a different room. We know like everybody knows what we'll do if that happens, what I've noticed that do for me is We don't get so far down the dysregulated path before I catch it. So I can kind of see things starting to escalate and I'm like, oh shit, we're going to the soft spot. You know? And we have, we created this spot that works for all of us. And you know, the other thing that I've worked on with in the therapy is like including the children. The other kids that aren't dysregulated let them also come.'cause it used to be that I would take them, I would take the dysregulated child, which is typically the same child. Over and over, and I would take her to my room and I would close the door and I'd tell her other sisters go away. And I was doing that in my mind to protect my other two children because when this one gets dysregulated, she's hitting, she's kicking, she's clawing. I wanna keep them safe. But what it's doing is it's taking me away from the other two. So now what we did was we created the soft spot in a room where all of us can go. There's things the other two can do to entertain themselves while we are calming down in the soft spot and sometimes calming down Looks calm and sometimes calming down. Looks like I'm bear hugging my child that's trying to beat the shit outta me and we're breathing and like just waiting it out and I'm staying calm. I'm working very hard to stay calm. And then at the end it's like, okay, does anybody else need anything? August, do you need a hug? June? Do you need a hug? Like, do you guys have anything to say? So that. Because she was saying, the therapist was saying like, then she sees like the other sibling that had the difficult sister or brother. Like they're in there feeling like, well, I wasn't important enough to my mom to get the attention. So like trying to, trying to be there for all

Collen: 32:08

The attention, right?

Cheryl: 32:09

Like I don't, I'm not worthy of attention because I didn't misbehave. Or then even worse, we're now Teaching them that like this big behavior gets all of mom's attention. And so then before you know it, you have three kids all having big behaviors that I, and then I'm like going out for cigarettes and never coming home.

Collen: 32:28

One of the things that I, that. I started thinking about was because I, I try so hard to be a really good mom. Like I, that's something that I really wanna be, and I try really hard to be that, but I can obviously, like every mom lose your shit. And I thought about one time, like imagine as an adult, like somebody yelling at you to put your fucking shoes on. Like, I would be like, Who the fuck are you? Like, don't tell me what to do. You know? And it's like this, this way of like, imagine if we talked to adults the way that we talk to our children sometimes. They wouldn't put with it. And while children are, you know, not necessarily mentally and emotionally developed all the way, but essentially they are, they're small people, right? And so really thinking about that has really like shook me where I was like, oh my God, if anyone talked to me this way, I would be like. You're nuts. Like, you know, why would you, why would, why would you talk to me that way? And it would be really hurtful. Like, and I would not be able to react in, in a normal way. I would not be, be able to stay calm. So to your point, if everything that you're saying, it's like, okay, yeah, we do need to slow down or we do need to slow down so that we can remain calm so that we can address these things, because I wouldn't want anybody to talk. To me the way that sometimes, you know, when I get frustrated and angry, I, I talk to my kids and it's heartbreaking to think about it, but you know, it's also just like continuing to learn and grow and give ourselves grace and all of that. But

Miriam Burlavosky: 34:14

course.

Collen: 34:15

it's so crazy.

Miriam Burlavosky: 34:18

Yeah. I.

Cheryl: 34:19

one. That's like, if you mess up with your kids, don't worry. You'll have a chance to do it again in like five minutes. Like to try again because they're gonna fuck with you again in five minutes. So, but then also I, I know that what I'm learning from parenting books and everything that I'm reading, I. Along these lines is we're the first generation that is then repairing with our kids after that and how important of a tool repair is. And so I, while I lose my shit, then there's, I. Shortly later, an apology. Mommy shouldn't have acted like that. I really lost my temper. And Alex often will take my more difficult child away. The one I, she's not more difficult, but she's more difficult for me. She's easier for Alex, where Alex has more trouble with a different child because we're each like, she's me. That's the problem, is she's me. And so, he'll take her away and then when he brings her back more regulated. She, he always makes her apologize to me, which is whatever, like I'm not gonna critique the way he's parenting, but I then am like, mommy's very sorry, actually. Like, I'm very sorry. I shouldn't have treated you like that, that that was too big of a reaction. I lost control of my temper, you know, humanizing myself. And sometimes I wonder, like Colleen you, we've had this conversation, like that moment where you realize your parents' a human.

Collen: 35:44

Yeah. It's hard.

Cheryl: 35:45

And like how shocking that is. I hope that by repairing with my kids, they're gonna grow up knowing I'm human and maybe they'll take some of that away.

Miriam Burlavosky: 35:55

You both are so evolved. I am so impressed with your, with your work that you're doing on yourselves as parents and as as humans. I'm really impressed, honestly.

Cheryl: 36:06

Thank

Miriam Burlavosky: 36:07

if I could offer, A phrase to, to work on those repair, reparative, conversations. You might say. and this is from other people's framework, but, when blank, when this happens, I feel so affirmative or affective statements rather. And then because of something else, and I'll give you an example in a second. I. You might say when you, when you make fun of my, let's talk about bodies. When you make fun of my body or when you make comments about my body, I feel shame and unloved. Shamed and unloved because I really need to be accepted and loved. So having that when. I feel, and then because framework, those sentence frames are very helpful. and then you might, just, like with kids, what we do is, we'll, we'll use those sentence frames and then have them have the other person respond. Have the student respond and say, oh. I didn't know you felt that way. And, and then they in turn will provide their own sentence frames, for how they felt when they were, they probably felt wronged in some way, which is why they said whatever they said. and then you can make, you can use the nonviolent communication framework. To make a sim simple request, so when this happened, I felt, because I really wanna be loved. I'd like to make the simple request that you don't comment on my body anymore, and I'd really appreciate it. Yeah.

Cheryl: 37:58

My kids are always talking about how big mom's butt is, or why, why does the, like, why's your tummy look like there's a baby in it, or whatever they might say. And I just tell them you, well, first of all, this is what mommy's body looks like right now. And all bodies change. Mommy's body hasn't always looked like this and mommy's body will not always look like this, but this is what my body looks like right now. And, um, it's like, I don't, I don't wanna talk about my body. I don't think we need to talk about the way my body looks. It's not important. But I think that More powerful would be to use that and it would humanize me to them. But the other probably part of this also is I had kind of spoke to it earlier, like, we'll have another opportunity to do it right in a few minutes.'cause they're gonna do it again. These kids. They're, they're not, that part of their brain is not developed until they're like 25. So appropriate expectations around the fact that like, we're gonna have to have a lot of these conversations and go through a lot of these experiences over and over and over, because they just simply are not fully developed yet. And it'll look different at different ages. But setting that appropriate expectation with myself in I'm talking to me, you guys can just listen to me like figure out how to parent right now, but setting the appropriate expectation that it's developmentally appropriate, the way they're behaving, and it's my job. Here's Dr. Becky and big little feelings to be a strong and confident leader, and I'm gonna have to do it over and over and over again

Miriam Burlavosky: 39:34

Yeah.

Collen: 39:35

and be willing to experience that over and over and over again. Like that's a, that's also a willingness on.

Cheryl: 39:42

Three of those children have come out, so I'm going to have to or have to give them away, like I already signed up for it. And I think that like we don't always Most people don't understand how hard parenting is. You remember telling someone recently, oh, you have to teach them everything. Like you teach them how to go to the bathroom in a potty. You teach them the appropriate way to say please and thank you. Like you literally are teaching these small, beautiful, amazing, difficult little humans, everything. It is not a small job that we've taken on, and I took on three very close in age, so. I'm trying to give myself a lot of grace because of that. Realizing that like I don't have a four year age gap where this child has developed to this point and can be helpful in teaching this. I'm kind of still teaching you something that's just slightly a smidge ahead of what I'm teaching your sister, which is just a slightly ahead of what I'm teaching your sister, and then now you feel pissed because she gets away with more than you do'cause you're not far enough ahead to realize. You're still really close and you're still all learning this together

Collen: 40:52

Yeah,

Cheryl: 40:52

dear lord and wine and help and then make good choices while and like, don't forget to exercise. Mm-Hmm.

Collen: 41:04

yeah. Yeah. Well, and

Miriam Burlavosky: 41:07

sure to put lipstick on and a mascara and put your heels on. You're, you don't wanna be not sexy for your husband, right? If in hetero normative,

Cheryl: 41:15

Mm-Hmm.

Miriam Burlavosky: 41:15

world.

Collen: 41:16

Put heels on

Cheryl: 41:17

don't forget to coconut oil

Collen: 41:19

but don't be too tall because if you're too tall, that's not good either. And like also be thin, but don't be too thin. But don't be fat, but don't, you know, but also have big boobs and a butt, but.

Cheryl: 41:34

And love yourself

Collen: 41:34

And love yourself and love your children and make meals, healthy meals, and like that's, I mean, I'm sure this is why Miriam, you have, like you, you have this profession, right? You have this because like, these are, this, this too much, y'all like all these things that we're supposed to do that we, and to be fair, like I wanna say If these are choices that I made, I, I made a choice to be married. I made a choice to have my children like these. I made a choice to be a, a working parent, like all choices that I've made, but holy shit, like there's no roadmap. There's no, I mean, my mom used to say this all the time and I hated when she said it, but she's like, there's no instruction manual when you have a kid, like they don't pop out with a book because no matter how many parenting books you read. Each kid is so different and so special and so individualized. And when you have multiple children like Norm, you have five. We each have three. Each kid, none of them are the same. What the hell's up with that? Like that's super challenging.

Miriam Burlavosky: 42:53

If I could tell you how many like foot in mouth moments I put I had in retrospect. Like in, we have these meetings in school, SST, their student success or student study team meetings. And I would have parents being like, oh, my 11-year-old still, sleeps in our room and is, you know, nervous and all these things. And I'm like, oh no, you cannot keep that going. You know, and I'm, you know, and then I'm having a foot and mouth moment. You know, 10 years later or 11 years later, when I have my 11-year-old and he's on my floor because

Collen: 43:30

Yeah.

Miriam Burlavosky: 43:31

that's what he needed that week, you know?

Cheryl: 43:34

I heard a saying once that said, I never ate so many words until I became a parent, and when I, when I heard that this was before I had children, I became very aware of, you don't get to have an opinion on something you've never experienced. You can have it, but you're like, you don't. It's unbased. It's. You know, so I really, really tried after that. And still, like, I know my experience as a parent in my house with my three children and with my husband and with our au pair and with the, the luxuries that we have and the deficits that we have. You know, we don't have family here. You know, there's like it's pros and cons, how we're doing this and like. Miriam, you have a different experience, Colleen. You have a different experience. Like we we're all who am, I can't, I've never walked a mile in either of your shoes. I don't get to have an opinion on how you're doing something. We're all just doing the best we can in our current set of circumstances, and that's enough. Just,

Miriam Burlavosky: 44:30

Yes,

Cheryl: 44:31

and then we just need that moment of still. So that we can have that pause between the trigger and the reaction so that we can react better. Because I do feel like in the moments where I'm flying off the handle, it's the things that I There's not a minute to respond. Like it's, somebody's gonna get hurt or somebody's hurting, or someone's gonna fuck up my hardwood floors. Or you know, it's like, ugh, I, I just have to like stop something. And those are the reactions that I'm the least proud of. If I can take a minute and be mindful and slow down, and I guess maybe that's like, yes, I need to stop the kids from hurting each other.

Miriam Burlavosky: 45:08

mm-Hmm.

Cheryl: 45:09

also, are they gonna hurt each other that bad in like a millisecond? It takes me to like recenter and ground. Probably not like, no, nobody's got a knife. I mean,

Collen: 45:17

Maybe they do. They

Cheryl: 45:19

Anyway. Sometimes

Miriam Burlavosky: 45:20

Not today,

Collen: 45:21

Not today.

Cheryl: 45:23

Yeah.

Miriam Burlavosky: 45:23

Yeah, but that's, no, that's great. How, how much damage is, is gonna happen and we, we do have to, I mean, I, I. I won't tell you where I work, but sometimes at school, I have to sort of, you know, I'm not gonna get in the middle of everything. Like, they're, they're, if they're little kids and they're, you know, doing something and if I am just gonna make it worse or if I'm gonna, my presence there, like to intervene is gonna get me hurt and them hurt. Like I'm, I'm just gonna step back and I'm like, okay, take a moment and. Okay. How bad could this possibly be? Let's evacuate everybody else from the classroom. Okay. They're starting to throw iPads. Okay. Um, they're starting to throw chairs. Okay. Well, um. If I restrain this child, is that gonna be more traumatic or is that like, how much harm can they do themselves versus, versus, you know, property is just property and I know that it can be expensive, but, you know, you just at least have a second to like, take that step back, take a beat.

Cheryl: 46:32

I agree. my sister works in a similar environment as you do, and she's gotten hurt a lot of times, and like restraints can go very wrong. Like the, the demographic that you're working with, It's, I can't like, bless you for what you're doing because, and it's such an important job and it's incredible and I know that a lot of people that work in the environment feel like you're the kind of the lucky ones, although I know there must be burnout and exhaustion. But anyhow, thank you for doing what you're doing in the schools. And,

Miriam Burlavosky: 47:02

Thanks.

Cheryl: 47:03

but I do know, like I, and I've been watching like different people on Instagram and stuff like. The tools you're using with those students to like reshape behaviors or teach them tools and skills are applicable in all of our lives, even if we don't have a disability like that it is so interesting to, to know that and see that. So anyhow, I'm just so grateful we had you here.

Miriam Burlavosky: 47:28

Oh, thanks.

Collen: 47:30

I feel like we need to have you on again because I feel like there's lots of things that we could continue to chat with you

Miriam Burlavosky: 47:35

Oh, I'd love

Collen: 47:36

so tell us where we can find you. Tell us what is your Instagram or how do we and your, what is your app again? Tell us that one more time.

Miriam Burlavosky: 47:44

I'm at mindful mi.com. It's mindful is M-I-N-D-F-U-L. Then second word, it's all one word, but MIRI, Miriam is my full name, but I go by Miri sometimes. So mindful miri.com is the website. I am mindful underscore miri at, Instagram. And the app is Mindful Miri on Apple and Google. And um, I also recently talking about burnout in teachers. I started a nonprofit for, burnout. I'm currently burnt out, I have firsthand experience. I'll, that's another conversation for another day, but, and that is, website for that is awesome educators.org.

Collen: 48:29

Hmm.

Cheryl: 48:30

Okay,

Miriam Burlavosky: 48:30

Yeah. So

Cheryl: 48:31

in show notes

Miriam Burlavosky: 48:33

awesome.

Cheryl: 48:34

share.

Collen: 48:34

you so much. Thank you for being here and for sharing with us and for listening to all of Cheryl NICE's problems.

Miriam Burlavosky: 48:43

Oh no, I love, I mean, I don't love it, but I love being the sounding board. I know. I'll invoice you your copays. No, I love being a sounding board and, and supporting. I think that we all do the best we can. Yeah. With the situations we're given.

Cheryl: 49:01

And we get to try again in five minutes, so don't worry too much Awesome. Well, thank

Miriam Burlavosky: 49:08

you.

Cheryl: 49:08

much for being here and yeah, we'll talk soon. Bye.